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Archived Folder TOO MANY SPECIAL NEEDS KIDS?
Special Education Forum
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Subj:  Too many special needs kids
Date:  95-10-28 10:31:32 EST
From:  JBeli70618

I teach in a small school district.  Our district is finding that we are
getting too many referrals for special education.  Many students are
qualifying for special education and many are not qualifying.  This leaves
the special education teachers with too many children to provide small group,
individualized attention and our regular education teacher with children who
do not qualify and don't know what to do with them.

I'm looking for ideas as to what can we do with these kids.  Our special
education teachers are overworked and don't have enough time in the day to
work with all students.  I'm curious if there are any programs that other
schools are currently using to help out these kids.  Currently, we have our
Title I program and Section 504 that we are using and these programs seem
maxed out.  Also, we're finding that we need to get parents more involved in
their child's education.  So, if anyone has any suggestions that would be
helpful or are currently using a program that is working for your district,
please e-mail me.

Thanks

Tammy
JBeli70618




Subj:  Re:Too many special needs kids
Date:  95-10-29 13:55:42 EST
From:  SusanS29

"This leaves the special education teachers with too many children to provide
small group, individualized attention and our regular education teacher with
children who do not qualify and don't know what to do with them.  "

Hire more special educators?

"Our special education teachers are overworked and don't have enough time in
the day to work with all students."

That's illegal, and if your district doesn't turn it around they could end up
with a lawsuit a whole lot more expensive than another.



Subj:  Re:Too many
special needs ki
Date:  95-10-29 15:24:31 EST
From:  AJBELLO285

Shouldn't the system work, wherever possible, that special ed teachers take
their expertise to the regular classroom and support the 'regular' teacher
for a particular child in need?  I'm sure there is a % of spec ed kids who
don't need to be pulled from regular class to go to spec ed room but just
need some extra support in regular class.  I think sometimes a different
approach to teaching a specific idea just needs to be explored for a student.

Forgive if I sound ignorant, but I have a child in special ed and do get to
see how some other spec ed kids are.



Subj:  Re:Too many special needs kids
Date:  95-10-29 18:53:10 EST
From:  FRECKELS R

I teach in a medium sized district and we utilize "content Mastery" for the
special education students who are learning disabled,  These students are too
high for resource classes, but cannot make it in the regular classroom
without supplemental help.  therefore, they utilize "CM" which has 2 full
time special education teachers and 2 aides to help give the needed one on
one help

Freckels R



Subj:  Re:Too many special needs kids
Date:  95-10-29 19:48:03 EST
From:  SusanS29

"I teach in a medium sized district and we utilize "content Mastery" for the
special education students who are learning disabled..."

ALL of them? My learning disabled student is capable of following a demanding
curriculum in most subjects. She's in advanced placement history. In math,
her weak area, she's two years behind most juniors in her school but she's
still taking standard curriculum.



Subj:  too many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-01 19:22:24 EST
From:  Camnbeth

I am extemely frustrated with the amount of students that are receiving
support and don't actually qualify for it. Has anyone ever stopped to think
that some of these kids are just lazy and want someone else to do their work.
I've seen a school district use their Reading Specialist and an At-Risk
full-time aide to help kid finish their homework!! This is crazy, what about
the kids that could really use this teacher's expertise? Anyone can help kids
do their homework!! All parents had to do was request that their child be
placed in this class- and WAALAA!!! I remember one family had two kids in
elementary school and both parents decided to go back to recieve their
medical degrees, so they requested(DEMANDED) that both kids be placed in this
classroom to ensure that their homework was completed before they got home!!!
What a waste of money, time, and expertise!! Has anyone else heard of such
craziness?!



Subj:  Re:too many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-02 08:41:43 EST
From:  SusanS29

"I am extemely frustrated with the amount of students that are receiving
support and don't actually qualify for it."

I am happy to say that this has not been my experience. Particularly at the
elementary level, "laziness" simply is *not* a cause for school problems.
What appears to be laziness is actually fairly serious difficulties. Solve
the difficulties and you suddenly discover a child who was often trying twice
as hard as the average child (and got called names like "lazy" for his or her
efforts.)

Even at higher grades we have to ask ourselves "What terrible thing happened
to cause this child to go against his essential human nature and *not want to
learn?" What a bizarre state for a human!

Your situation does sound extreme. I have to tell you I've talked with
hundreds of teachers and thousands of parents across the country and have
never heard of this kind of practice elsewhere.

But this doesn't make the kids "lazy." It makes the administration spineless
and stupid (grin).



Subj:  Re:too many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-02 10:42:40 EST
From:  ShelliC

I am shocked at the attitude of some of you teachers. I have a son w/ CP who
may need special ed clasess as he gets older.. I certainly hope he gets a
GOOD teacher and not one with the attitudes I've seen expressed here! How
incredibly insensitive to say some of these kids are lazy!





Subj:  Re:too many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-02 16:53:03 EST
From:  LLerette

My son was diagnosed as LD and does qualify for a special education teacher
to provide him with additional help in the classroom.  When approached by the
school, I did allow for the I.E.P. to be done for him.  Now that he does
qualify as "learning disabled" per the school, I have to fight tooth and nail
just to get the services that I have been told by the school he needs, the
services that are my right and my son's right to have.  When I go to the
school to demand these services be done for him and that the I.E.P. be
written to specify the exact amount of time and have a daily log done, etc. I
get nothing but resistance.  I don't understand.  This is the special
education department's JOB.  I can't believe the grudging, resistant attitude
I get from not only the special ed teacher, but from the main teacher.  I
would think that my insistance on having the special ed teacher in the
classroom would only be helpful to her.  I make my son work extra hard at his
homework.  I make my son dictate to me on the computer and then rewrite it.
He works twice as hard as many other kids have to.  My son is not lazy, for
someone to even imply that these kids are, is just plain ignorant.



Subj:
Re:too many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-02 18:54:17 EST
From:  Camnbeth

It seems to me that many people are looking for a fight over the internet! It
was not my intention to lable Special Ed kids as lazy, but it was my
intention to lable kids who receive Special Services without having a legal
disability as lazy. You may think that I'm insensitve to Special Ed kids, but
I'm more sensitive than some of you realize. I'm angry because kids are
getting away with crying wolf and causing the student to teacher ratio to
rise in Special Ed classrooms, which in turn places the kids who really have
disabilities and need intensive support in a position of not receiving the
assistance that they need and deserve! Instead their teachers are forced to
divide their attention between kids who qualify and kids who see such
services as a means of avoiding completing assignments on his/her own! I'm
new to the district I'm teaching in and have yet to figure out what exactly
is going on with illegal placement, but it's happening! This is terribly
upsetting to me to know that kids qualifying for help are having to share
their teachers with kids who don't technically qualify! Now do you still want
to call me insensitive?! Read between the lines and don't always be so quick
to draw negative conclusions from what you're reading! I have received two
teaching awards- one for beginning teacher of the year, and one for teacher
of the year. I fight for the rights and inclusion of my students on a daily
basis, and make certain they receive the accommodations/support they deserve
in their regular classroom environments. I am a good teacher who cares for my
students and fight for them as if they were my own!!!



Subj:  Re:ShelliC
Date:  95-11-02 23:12:38 EST
From:  JGarcia378

There is a very good chance that the person who wrote that letter had no
special education training.  Most of the teachers I have encountered in this
profession are dedicated and care a great deal about their students learning.
This profession is not a field one goes into for the money or because it is
an easy job.  In order not to burn out you must be dedicated to the
profession and enjoy what you do.  I hope you find this to be true when you
meet the special education faculty that will teach your child.



Subj:  Re:too
many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-03 10:57:51 EST
From:  Camnbeth

The intent of my intial letter was not to display anger towards students or
their parents that use Special Education services and don't actually qualify.
Instead it was asking other teachers if they have ever seen a Reading
Specialist fulfill his/her teaching role in such a manner. This is my first
year teaching in this state, and I wondered if this occurs in other states.
Regardless of the situation, all of the Special Educators at this school
continue to fulfill our teaching roles with enthusiam towards our kids. My
letter was to question the administration and not the kids! On another note,
I truly hope that no parent (such as the mother of the child with Cerebral
Palsy) ever has to deal with a Special Educator who displays a negative
attitude, or makes suggestions (in your child's I.E.P.) that don't meet your
expectations. Just remember that as long as you remain involved with your
child's education, you can demand that he/she receives excellent services!
The I.E.P. is designed to protect and ensure your child receives the proper
education he/she deserves. Speak up and be heard in the I.E.P. meetings! I'm
sure your child will receive a great education with your input/support! P.S.
Sorry about the misspelling/typo of label !




Subj:  ShellieC
Date:  95-11-03 18:30:35 EST
From:  JBeli70618

You are right about your son receiving special education sevices if he
qualifies.  The special education teacher and his regular education teacher
have no right to deny your son services.  Make an appointment with the
school's - school psychologist or even the special education director for
your district to express your concern for your son's IEP not being written
and services not being provided.  By law, your district needs to provide LD
services for your son if he was identifed as having a handicapping condition
at a Multidisciplinary Team meeting.

Good Luck!!



Subj:  Re:too many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-03 22:27:27 EST
From:  SusanS29

"I'm insensitve to Special Ed kids, but I'm more sensitive than some of you
realize. I'm angry because kids are getting away with crying wolf and causing
the student to teacher ratio to rise in Special Ed classrooms, which in turn
places the kids who really have disabilities and need intensive support in a
position of not receiving the assistance that they need and deserve!"

I must admit I am totally baffled by this. I taught special education for 20
years and only rarely had a student who didn't truly need the help. When the
occasional rare child was misdiagnosed it really wasn't hard to get them
removed from the caseload.

Special education is completely controlled and governed by federal
guidelines, and those federal guidelines are most specific. This truly should
be a non-issue.

As for this, Camnbeth: "It seems to me that many people are looking for a
fight over the internet!"

 here are your exact earlier words in your first post:

"Has anyone ever stopped to think that some of these kids are just lazy and
want someone else to do their work."

Now -- speaking as host of this forum -- it is one thing to have a view, and
quite another to say others are looking for a fight when they respond to a
clear challenge.

Please let's make sure we keep the discussion civil. It's inevitable: parents
of special needs children *have* to wonder if you'd be talking about their
child, if their child was in your class.



Subj:  Re:too many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-03 22:29:39 EST
From:  SusanS29

From your forum host:

I ask you all to NOT "Read between the lines... "

I urge all to read what is on the screen, interpret it in the best possible
way, count to ten before clicking on "post" when angry, but to *not* read
between the lines, as it's a guaranteed path to misunderstandings.

It is the poster's responsibility to say what he or she means, and not leave
it to the guesswork of the reader.

SusanS29-Forum Host





Subj:  Re:too many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-03 22:59:03 EST
From:  LLMoo

This is my second year teaching in my school district.  With the budget cuts
and the increase in my count I have been told by the MDT that I need to start
shaving off minutes off kids so I can serve all. I have loved my job and the
growth the students have made with our intense program of reading and
spelling mastery plus reading the regular basal. I am looking for help in
what to do. My caseload is currently 36 with 7 assessments in progress. I
have 5 EA's which 3 high impact kids utilize three of these people. Everyone
is very dedicated but I need more EA time. I have been told with the cuts
that's it -any suggestions -please e-mail me thanks  oh by the way I teach in
an elementary school. Moo



Subj:  new special needs student
Date:  95-11-03 23:02:21 EST
From:  Gundug

I received a new student who does not qualify as learning disabled but the
classification form wrote that she has "special needs". We don't have this
classification in our district, yet her classification does not expire for
another 2 years. What do I do?



Subj:  Re:new special needs student
Date:  95-11-04 15:32:14 EST
From:  SusanS29

"I received a new student who does not qualify as learning disabled but the
classification form wrote that she has "special needs". "

Find out what they mean by "special needs." Maybe she has ADD -- in which
case she really is eligible for various kinds of help, even if she doesn't
test as LD.



Subj:  Re:too many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-08 12:31:43 EST
From:  Mimi126

Camnbeth,
I am a parent of a special needs child(PDD). I must tell you that i do agree
that there are plenty of kids in the program that truly don't need special
ed.  Many school districts in my area bring on spec. ed. children for the
money they receive from the state.  Others bring them on because the parents
fight for it( many do this because they don't have to pay for it, so they
look at it as a preschool program. )
I didn't take what you said in the wrong way, and I was not offended by what
you said.  I must say however, that  many people on the internet, including
hosts, are rude ,condescending,  and nasty. I have chosen for that reason to
stop participating in some forums and stopped writing on some message boards.
Some times you need to read between the lines and make sense of what is said.
Don't give up because of a few nasty people.  email MIMI126
Good Luck!!





Subj:  Re: SusanS29
Date:  95-11-13 21:51:22 EST
From:  Mimi126

Read my notes in INCLUSION AND AUTISM-it sums eveything up.  Also, why are
ther no messages since 11-8. I can't believe that noone out there hasnt
written anything.



Subj:  Re: SusanS29
Date:  95-11-13 22:47:32 EST
From:  SusanS29

No messages have disappeared from this folder.

SusanS29, Host



Subj:  too many special needs kids
Date:  95-11-19 20:10:00 EST
From:  Post1deb

I am the mother of a child who tests in the trainable mentally impaired range
and also a special education teacher, currently working in an inclusion
kindergarten classroom.....We need to remember that there is a very wide
range of skill levels  among children in our special education system.
Programs that work for those in resource rooms, will probably not work for
those in self contained EMI and TMI programs.....The beauty of the system is
(when it is working correctly) that there is a individual program for each
and every special needs child.




Subj:  Re:too many special ed kids?
Date:  95-11-19 21:15:16 EST
From:  Bemrose

Woa Folks. Yes there are lazy kids, yes ther are lazy LD kids yes lazy ED
kids, and yes there are insensitive teachers, and super sensitive parents.
Remember how the EMR label has all but disappeared to a more acceptable LD
label. However it is important to discuss issues and observations. For
instant has there not been an increase of identifying LD kids in High School
now that SAT has adaptation for a "special"kid. Yes there are abuses. But
with school districts reflecting a special education populations between 10
-25 %, I would suggest they are no longer special but part of the main. Do
other countries identify similar % of special kids? Why are so many kids
labeled ADD in US ( and frequently prescribed medication ), but they are not
seen (significantly ) in a relatively civilised country, England. I visited
Emotionally Disturbed residential schools in UK and none of the kids were ADD
or receiving Ritalin (stimulant ) meds. Yet 905 of my ED  kids ( in a public
school ) have an ADD label, and most have (or had) taken Ritalin. Folks lets
continue to talk but in a rational debate. Leave Camnbeth alone and lets
address her points and issues. email to me would be welcome: ( SNT Wales  @
aol.com.) if you have comment on my observations.



Subj:  Re:too many special
ed kids?
Date:  95-11-20 15:03:06 EST
From:  SusanS29

"Why are so many kids labeled ADD in US ( and frequently prescribed
medication ), but they are not seen (significantly ) in a relatively
civilised country, England."

As a matter of fact more and more professionals are getting educated on ADD.
Look for those numbers to go up. The numbers have gone up quite a bit in
Germany in the past few years, and Scandanavian countries are doing some of
the most forward-thinking research in the field of ADD going on today.

Can you clarify this? "Yet 905 of my ED  kids..." You have over 900 kids
labeled ED? (I bet that's not what you meant -- grin).



Subj:  no such problem
Date:  95-11-27 15:07:44 EST
From:  Alandtis

in order to have a kid there must be two people and on is sure still around
there for every kid has the own personal teacher with that all the must be
done is to get th parents involed this is when one can use the reality that
there kid will either be a success or a failure is entire resting on thye
parents shoulder not the teacher . teacher are there to guide the learning
the parent is the to inspire it and if they wish not to than they are not
true a parent but part of the problem



Subj:  We're all part of the problem
Date:  95-11-28 19:57:59 EST
From:  Whiting95

Our culture breeds individuality; we encourage and empower our children to
speak out and ask for what they need.  The parents of these same children are
learning to voice their opinions/beliefs/wishes of their school systems.  I
am an accomodating parent and teacher working hard to keep my own head above
water.  I do my best to provide for all students, learning disabled/a.d.d/or
whatever.  To me they all are special.  What I resent is when a parent
demands something or puts down what I do for their child.  I am only doing
what I have been taught and believe to the best of my ability is right.  I am
also only human.  I am not a miracle worker, nor is anyone else I know.
There are limitations on what a given teacher can do in any given situation.
Yes, advocate for your child; but please, invest in a little trust that the
professionals involved care and are doing what they can.  I know it's not the
same everywhere, but I believe that there is much too little trust all the
way around.  It's not fair to any child to have his/her parent "bad mouth"
their program and then turn around and send him/her to that very program
expecting that they have the trust and desire necessary for authentic
learning to occur.  Let's all wake up and pay closer attention to ourselves
and do a little less pointing towards others' shortcomings.
Acceptance has to start at home.  School's can't and shouldn't be expected to
fix everything.



Subj:  Too many special needs
Date:  95-11-29 23:11:29 EST
From:  AHayes1170

I am a public school speech language pathologist and I don't believe there
are more special needs kids.  I think the problem is that a large majority of
regular education teachers have become less tolerant of children who learn
differently.  They then look to special education to "fix" the child or
provide a majority of the child's education rather than just accepting the
fact that not every child is going to learn the same way.   I believe that
the reason regular education teachers have become unable to cope with
"different" children is a direct result of the mistakes we have made in
special education.  We have crippled the teachers in this area by being too
willing to make a child special ed rather than looking for ways to enable the
regular education teacher.  I completely sympathize with those of us in
special education who have too may special needs kids, I myself have an
active caseload of 50, but I think it's time we quit seeing regular education
and special education as seperate entities.   We need to work to enable all
of us to provide the best education for each and every child by working
together and realizing that there is no magic cure for these kids, there is
not anything any one of us can do alone to make a difference.




Subj:  Re:Too many special needs
Date:  95-11-30 23:11:34 EST
From:  Kenner 14

AHayes.......I too work in a public school as a Speech Pathologist with a
Preschool Special Day Class and from my perspective there are DEFINITELY more
special needs children and I have watched it grow over 10 years in the
business!  As recently as five years ago there were TWO Special Day Classes
in my school with 16 to 20 children from Preschool through third grade.  This
year there are FOUR Special Day Classes with 48 children!  Simply based on
numbers here you can see the growth has more than DOUBLED.  The children we
get in Special Day now have more significant needs than they did previously.
I would generally have children who were deemed Communicatively Handicapped.
These children generally had average or above average cognitive ability with
an area of deficit of perhaps auditory processing, expressive language,
receptive language or some combination.  Now the children in my class have
various disABILITIES.  I have low-functioning, autistic and down syndrome
children now.  I love my job and love those kids!



Subj:  Re:Too many special
needs
Date:  95-12-01 21:39:47 EST
From:  LFVISGITUS

I have been a special education teacher for 15 years and have had experiences
ranging from self-contained programs (in the early 80's) to developing and
sustaining an inclusion program in a district with a population of about
3,000 students.  We have students with ranges of all abilities and
challenges: Special Education students, ESL, abused and at risk students (as
well as their parents).  We do not have natural proportions and we are
dealing with severe budget cutbacks.  However, we have a vision for and a
committment to all students.  Teachers use a Child Study Process to identify
needs, resources, etc.  Parents are welcomed and in many cases nutured to
become equal partners.  Decisions for the child are made my the team (which
includes the parent) working directly with the student.  Administration
supports the development of one educational system which enriches the
classroom environment for all learners.  Is this easy?
No.  It has taken years of inservice, discussion, willingness to risk, know
the literature for best practices..... Perhaps if districts examined other
alternatives to Total School Improvement, students with special needs will
not be first looked at as a number or drain on a professionals caseload, but
a member who brings diversity and positive challenge to a classroom.

  By the way, I work with 4 regular education teachers who equally share with
me the responsibility of teaching the 90 students on our team.  We have an
aide in each classroom who will help individual or groups of students
depending on needs.  I rotate by pushing in to co-teach, be the regular tchr,
or support small groups to teach alternative lessons.



Subj:  Re:Too many
special needs
Date:  95-12-11 14:38:20 EST
From:  Amos McD

Just reading through the messages and thought I would add a different
perspective.  One reason there actually may be more special needs kids lately
is because there are more babies being born sick (premature, heart trouble,
spina bifida, etc, etc.) that are surviving due to gains in medical
technology.   My 8 year old son was born prematurely and is in special ed
since age 4.  The older he gets the more apparent certain difficulties become
in school.  I know of many kids in our school district's special ed.
preschool who were sick at birth.  Now I hope no one is thinking maybe these
kids shouldn't be allowed to survive if they are going to take up room later
in special ed.  I also have a 4 year old,  full-term healthy at birth,  who
is in special ed since age 3 for language and fine motor delay. So go figure!

I think its best to take the view that if kids need help they should get it,
and if the schools err on the side of putting a few too many kids in that
don't end up needing special ed., its better than if the kids that do need it
(and are borderline for qualifying) don't get it.
I think the lack of resources (MONEY!) for special ed comes from the general
state of apathy the U.S. has over education.  If the regular classrooms can't
get what they need, the government takes away from special ed.  This tirade
of mine could go on forever!!, so I'll just leave it at this.
Thanks for listening.



Subj:  special needs
Date:  96-01-01 13:48:48 EST
From:  OMEGA1380

New at this, interested to know if gifted students are classified as kids
with special needs?
can any one out there help me?



Subj:  Re:special needs
Date:  96-01-02 12:01:15 EST
From:  Jwmlda

Gifted children are recognized as having special needs.  They may be
protected under state law, but there is no law for gifted student similar to
the IDEA



Subj:  Re:We're all part of the pro
Date:  96-01-03 10:09:29 EST
From:  USAisNo1

It's true we are all part of the problem.  The solution is simple but because
of the funding given to special ed programs we have to complicate it.  As a
parent of  a child with a disability I resent the  fact that most schools
feel they have superior knowledge to my child's needs than I do.  School
systems need to give some trust to the parents also it's not like we wait
until the child goes to school to learn what works for them we start from the
day they are born trying to help them find their place in the world.  We look
for answers everywhere and usually try almost anything to help our child
achieve as much as possible.  We have also come to realize that programs
designed for the norm of the disabled group do not always work for our
children.  We are interested in finding the solution to our child's needs and
as a parent we deserve a say in our child's education whether we agree with
the program or not.  Do not expect parents to accept your programs at face
value because we have had previous experience with our child and have a good
sense of what he/she needs.  Sometimes school professionals become upset that
parents just don't accept everything they have to offer, they just need to
remember we wake up everyday thinking of ways to help our children get the
most out of their lives and we are the one's who will still be looking for
ways long after the child has left the special education programs of the
schools.



Subj:  Re:Too many special needs ki
Date:  96-01-09 17:27:36 EST
From:  CarrotsC

hi,  welcome to reality!!!!!

We, as special education teachers are over worked.  I think the problem is a
teaching disability not a learning disability!



Subj:  Re:Too many special
needs ki
Date:  96-01-11 14:49:30 EST
From:  APalachek

Hi!  So many thoughts passed through my head as I read all of your messages.
It is encouraging to hear of so many invested teachers, and so discouraging
to hear of the problems caused by sheer numbers and lack of funding.  I
taught music for many years (and you know what funding has done to THAT
program...smile), and became a full-time mom once my daughter came home from
the hospital.  Since she spent 20 months in the hospital, and the next 22
months on a ventilator at home, I must agree with Amos McD that we are saving
more children these days.  She is now 7 1/2 yrs. old, and the light of our
lives.  It is hard to trust folks who do not know how difficult it has been
just to keep her alive, but we try our best.  Thank you for sharing your
hearts and your minds with children like my daughter.  Thank you for the pain
you obviously feel that the hours are too short and the demands just too
big...it shows that we are all invested in the same end:  Doing the best for
each of the kids we have come to love.

My child has multiple disabilities, and we have had to deal with para
professionals who have disagreed with inclusion, and even said that she is
"maxed out, and will never go any farther."  It has encouraged me to read
your messages.  On behalf of my daughter and me, thank you for never giving
up...we won't either.



Subj:  Re:Too many special needs ki
Date:  96-01-11 23:53:46 EST
From:  SusanS29

"My child has multiple disabilities, and we have had to deal with para
professionals who have disagreed with inclusion, and even said that she is
"maxed out, and will never go any farther."  It has encouraged me to read
your messages.  On behalf of my daughter and me, thank you for never giving
up...we won't either."

I don't know your child, so of course I don't know if she is "maxed out"
(what a terrible way to say such a thought) or not. BUT I can tell you a
couple of things.

No matter how difficult her start in life, she's still a human being -- and I
mean that in the biological sense. This means her brain will develop in
stages just as the brain of a child who didn't have such a difficult start.

Until her brain is fully developed, *no one* knows what her strengths will
be.

And I'll tell you a story about a woman I tutored. She had been quite bright
before the auto accident that did tremendous damage to her brain 12 years
ago. She and her family were told multiple times starting not more than a
year after the accident that she had recovered all her abilities she was
going to recover. Unfortunately she was all but non-verbal although she
understood what was said to her.

Because of *her* dogged determination (how could we, her tutors, give up when
she wouldn't)? -- first she acquired some nouns, and then some verbs... now
she speaks in full sentences and uses both present and past tense. When
people are patient with her she can truly communicate with them. The speed
and rhythm of her speech continue to improve.

She -- and her parents -- are so glad they didn't listen to those first
predictions.



Subj:  Re:Too many special needs ki
Date:  96-01-21 09:26:21 EST
From:  Advocate1D

This is my first time in this area.  I too am a parent of a special ed child.
My son has down syndrome and is 12 years old.  He was brought back to his
home school in 3rd grade and is now in the 6th grade.  He is mainstreamed or
included for all of his non academic classes and we are now working on
including him in some academic areas.
Scott has shown everyone that they should not give up on him.  He is more
involved than the average child with ds, but he is continuing to make
progress.
We have had wonderful teachers and paraprofesionals working with him.  We
have monthly team meetings where everyone who is involved in his school day
attends.  This is a time to review his strengths and areas where we need to
focus in on.  I am very thankful that Scott has what he has and so many
people care about him for the person he is.
Special Ed. students are people first.  If everyone keeps that in mind it
makes life a little easier for everyone involved.



Subj:  Re:Too many special
needs ki
Date:  96-01-24 12:34:36 EST
From:  Car1964

I agree, my son has been in Special Ed classes since he was in 2nd grade, he
is now in 6th grade and 12 1/2 years old.  At first I believe he needed it,
and thought we were doing the right thing for our sons education.  But now,
it is only holding him back.  He is in regular 6th grade classes for
everythig except English, Reading and Comprehension.  His teacher from 5th
grade was making him do book reports every week and multipule choice spelling
words.  Now that he is with a different teacher she just now in the middle of
the school year is having him do book reports and is still giving multi
choice spelling tests!!!!!!  His grade have been slipping even on the EASY
things!  He just want out and to have a chance to be a "regular" 6th grader.
He and we understand it will be hard for him but he is very unhappy.  His
reading is average I believe.  He does have trouble reading really large
words though.  His written work has alot of misspellings but that is because
our "Special Ed" classes in our district are afraid of '"pushing" him to
hard.  So they never stressed on him to correct his work.  He has gotten
LAZY!!!!!  We now have to try somehow to fight and get him out!  If worse
comes to worse, we will pull him out and I will have to home school him for
the rest of the year, and believe me that is the very last thing I want to
do!  I have 2 other children to take care of!  Please if you or anyone else
has any comments or ideas e-mail me at Car1964



Subj:  Re:too many special ed
kids?
Date:  96-01-24 12:39:58 EST
From:  Car1964

To Camnbeth, I so agree, I posted a message here maybe you have read it about
my 6th grade son?  I want my son out of Special Ed and school is fighting us
every step of the way.  The way my sons teacher has been since school started
you would think by her actions she wants these kids in the system forever so
she has a job!  She treats the children such as my son who mainly need help
in spelling and his written work like they are in 2nd grade.  The work she
gives them is unbelievable!!!!    I am so upset.  I believe now we need to go
to a hearing or something!!!!!  If you have anything to add e-mail me because
I don't often go online here and read the messages.
My e-mail address is here on AOL;             Car1964




Subj:  Re:We're all part of the pro
Date:  96-01-24 13:02:14 EST
From:  Car1964

To USA, Oh my gosh how I agree with you!!!!!   I have alot to share here, but
I did leave to other messages on this board already.  I have been TRYING to
work with my sons Jr. high now since school started with no luck.  We are now
most likely have to have a hearing to GET HIM OUT OF HIS SPECIAL ED CLASSES!!
Is teacher has only held his progress back.   The things she started teaching
his group this school year are things he was working on in the end of 4th
grade and the beg. 5th grade!!!!  She and the program has wasted 5 months of
my sons life!!!!!!  We put him in this program to hopefully eventually get
out of the system by the end of Jr. High, but at this pace he will maybe, if
he is lucky learn how to spell 4 more words by 8th grade!!!!
I will send USA mail.  I hope I have not offended anyone, I am just very
upset, I just want the best for my son and the school thinks they are doing
what is right for OUR SON!!!!
FROM, Car1964



Subj:  Re:We're all part of the pro
Date:  96-01-24 21:38:45 EST
From:  SusanS29

I don't think you've offended anyone. He's *your* child, and if you don't
watch out for him -- who will?

As for this: "We are now most likely have to have a hearing to GET HIM OUT OF
HIS SPECIAL ED CLASSES!!  Is teacher has only held his progress back."

Gather up his IEPs. They have to test every year, so you should have proof
that he hasn't progressed. However make sure their response isn't to put him
in a more restrictive special education environment.



Subj:  Re:We're all part
of the pro
Date:  96-01-25 01:04:12 EST
From:  Oynk oynk

I, unfortunately, agree with a lot of what I am hearing; however I must also
urge a little caution.

If these teachers are indeed just teaching all the students in a class at one
low, easy, level than you have definite cause for alarm.  BUT you also need
to find out if their is a reason for what they are doing.

I often get students with large gaps in their skills and knowledge.  They do
need to be backed up a bit because they have never been properly taught.
This is just a temporary (and short-lived) measure, but it is important.  It
may just be that your 8th grader is missing crucial 4/5th grade skills that
once mastered will allow him to progress at a much faster rate.

Here's hoping that's the case.



Subj:  Re:We're all part of the pro
Date:  96-01-25 21:14:04 EST
From:  SusanS29

"I often get students with large gaps in their skills and knowledge.  They do
need to be backed up a bit because they have never been properly taught.
This is just a temporary (and short-lived) measure, but it is important."

Absolutely, Oynk! Filling in the major gaps is crucial, and we do the student
no favor if we skip that when it's needed.



Subj:  Teaching Disabled Profs
Date:  96-02-07 10:24:44 EST
From:  FishToys

My own experience with my LD & my son's is that although we are smart, no one
hooked into our learning style. Does this mean that we are LD? Of course. It
also means that the teaching process must recognize that multiple learning
styles exist and start identifying and teaching to them. In this way we are
adressing all children's needs as well as all teacher's needs to teach
differently.
I live in the 5 boros of New York, and will gladly help anyone looking for
referrals for testing, schools, lawyers, and info on working with the Bd. Of
Ed. here.